Good News: “Climate Change” Causes More And Less Antarctic Ice

Because “climate change” causes everything

(Daily Mail) Earlier this year, global warming was blamed for the ‘irreversible retreat’ of west Antarctic glaciers.

But now scientists claim that warming of the planet is in fact behind a paradoxical growth in South Pole sea ice.

The comments come as Antarctica’s sea ice set a record this week, reaching 815,448 square miles (1,312,000 square km) of ice above its normal range.

Scientists believe the shift is caused by water melting from beneath the Antarctic ice shelves and re-freezing back on the surface.

‘The primary reason for this is the nature of the circulation of the Southern Ocean — water heated in high southern latitudes is carried equatorward, to be replaced by colder waters upwelling from below, which inhibits ice loss,’ Mark Serreze, director of the National Snow and Ice Data Centre, told Harold Ambler at Talking About the Weather.

Did the word “cult” just cross your mind? As all Skepetics know, there is no way to win a debate with Warmists, as Warmists will always have an excuse.

However, as reported in a separate blog post by Mr Ambler, Nasa scientist Walt Meier said that growing Antarctic sea ice coverage is less significant a measure than declining Arctic sea ice coverage when assessing climate change.

But, of course. If the reverse was happening, we’d hear that the Arctic didn’t matter. Of course, none of this proves anthropogenic causation. Just a typical Holocene warm period.

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10 Responses to “Good News: “Climate Change” Causes More And Less Antarctic Ice”

  1. Jeffery says:

    Yeah, them dumb ol’ scientists are saying sea ice and land ice are different things that may act differently.

    The way science works is that one investigates inconsistent results and attempts to explain them based on physical principles.

    Deniers rely on semantics and magic.

  2. gitarcarver says:

    Deniers rely on semantics and magic.

    Really?

    You have repeatedly said that the oceans are holding increased heat and that the ocean temperature has risen.

    Assuming the amount of heat transfer within the earth’s system is consistent, how would you explain an increase in sea ice from warmer water in a warmer system?

    Is it your contention that warmer water takes less thermal energy transfer to make ice than colder water?

  3. david7134 says:

    I don’t want to seem to go off topic, but this is the same, exact same, thing that the liberals did with dietary fats. I have indicated this before. Now, a book, tailored to laymen, has come out that well documents the lies, politics and obfuscation of data associated with the issue of cholesterol. The book is “The Big Fat Diet Surprise”. It is a good read, only it will make your blood pressure go up as you realize how we have been duped and lied to for 50 years. In addition, millions have died secondary to the liberals obsession with a diet concept when the real cause of cardiovascular disease has been ignored.

  4. Jeffery says:

    g2,

    You know the answers to your own questions. Why would you assume that the heat transfer is uniform? The oceans are vast and different regions can have different qualities. The tropics are warm, the poles cold. Overall, the oceans are warmer but yet sea ice still forms in the Arctic during winter! In general, ice freezes at 0C.

  5. Jl says:

    “Deniers rely on semantics and magic…” Yes, semantics such as “gee, all the stuff that was supposed to happen isn’t happening.” As far as magic, what magic? The earth warming and cooling as in the past isn’t magic. Thinking a trace gas works like a giant climate control knob would be closer to magic.

  6. gitarcarver says:

    You know the answers to your own questions.

    I may know, but it is clear that you don’t as you are trying to bs your way through this.

    Why would you assume that the heat transfer is uniform?

    Because the rate of heat transfer is a physical constant. But you fail to understand the question (or maybe you understand the question and just don’t want to address it.)

    The amount of heat within the system is either a constant or not a constant, but you anti-science types are claiming the amount is rising. Thus it takes more energy to lower temps to the point of freezing.

    If the oceans temps are rising, where is the extra energy to freeze warmer water coming from?

    The amount of sea ice in the Antarctic is increasing and hit a high for this time of year.

    Where is that energy coming from, Jeffery?

    Oh, and what gets worse for you is that sea ice freezes at below -20C. The energy needed to freeze is exponential – not linear. Thus, it takes more energy to cool something at -20 than it does at 0C.

    We know that the Antarctic volume of ice has increased more than the Arctic has decreased.

    Where is that energy coming from, Jeffery?

    How is it that with the temps of the ocean water higher, and with the air temps higher that there is more ice? Where is that energy coming from?

    I know that it is difficult for people of your ilk to actually understand science like thermodynamics, but since you are all fired sure that you are correct and always say that others are wrong, the question remains “where is that extra energy coming from?”

    Magic? Unicorn and faery dust?

  7. Jeffery says:

    In fact even the Antarctic sea temperature is rising, g1! Yet Antarctic sea ice is increasing, g1!

    here’s one explanation – http://www.nature.com/ngeo/journal/v6/n5/abs/ngeo1767.html

    “In contrast to Arctic sea ice, sea ice surrounding Antarctica has expanded, with record extent in 2010. This ice expansion has previously been attributed to dynamical atmospheric changes that induce atmospheric cooling. Here we show that accelerated basal melting of Antarctic ice shelves is likely to have contributed significantly to sea-ice expansion. Specifically, we present observations indicating that melt water from Antarctica’s ice shelves accumulates in a cool and fresh surface layer that shields the surface ocean from the warmer deeper waters that are melting the ice shelves.”

    and, g1,

    http://psc.apl.washington.edu/zhang/Pubs/Zhang_Antarctic_20-11-2515.pdf

    “The ice melting from ocean heat flux decreases faster than the ice growth does in the weakly stratified Southern Ocean, leading to an increase in the net ice production and hence an increase in ice mass. This mechanism is the main reason why the Antarctic sea ice has increased in spite of warming conditions both above and below during the period
    1979–2004 and the extended period 1948–2004.”

    So where did the extra energy come from? The Sun, of course, g1. Warming has caused an increase in precipitation (fresh water, by the way) leading to a stable colder freshwater layer that more easily freezes than the warmer sea water below. More recently, the freshwater melt of the Antarctic ice sheet is thought to contribute to the freshwater layer.

    So, if you accept as facts (and you should) that the southern ocean is warming, the Antarctic ice sheet is melting and the Antarctic sea ice is increasing, how would you explain the physics?

  8. gitarcarver says:

    Jeffery,

    Thanks.

    You made every point that I was trying to make.

    Now, despite your protestations to the contrary, you should really look at the second citation you give. It is from 2006 when people of your ilk were claiming that the sea ice was actually declining.

    That means that while you are trying to argue that the sea ice is declining, the paper says it was increasing.

    Geez it sucks to be you.

    The first article shows exactly the downfall of the AGW theory. It shows that the world’s climate is a dynamic system that cannot be viewed as a homogenous system which is what AGW relies upon for the unscientific.

    In short, you got caught trying to pass something off which shows that you are more interested in protecting the theory rather than the facts.

    Geez, it really sucks to be you.

  9. Nighthawk says:

    Being an ex Navy Sonar Tech what is being said about surface and deeper ocean temps makes no sense.

    I used to have to measure ocean temps on a regular basis, at the surface and at depth, to find the ‘surface duct’ where my sonar set operated. The deeper the duct the better our range. The Surface duct began at the surface and would continue down at a fairly constant temp. It is when this temp made a sudden decline marked the depth of the surface duct. The deeper the ‘Bathythermograph’ went, the colder it got.

    There were times when we had little or no surface duct but the temps still declined with depth. So saying that the deeper ocean is melting ice so it can refreeze at the surface goes in complete opposition to what I have seen in regards to ocean temp and depth.

  10. Jeffery says:

    g2,

    lol, I can understand why you’re jealous, but it’s really an unattractive quality in someone who at times pretends to be serious. And that sucking fetish you have… not that there’s anything wrong with that.

    It’s been known that Antarctic sea ice has been gradually increasing since satellites starting measuring it, so I don’t know what your game is concerning the 2007 paper. I think you’re just lashing out.

    You are invited to read the papers and reach your own conclusions.

    The southern ocean is warming, the Antarctic ice sheet is melting, the extent of the Antarctic sea ice is expanding. Do you have a comment on those three facts? Otherwise, what’s your point other than to stamp your feet? Do you have a well-considered hypothesis as to why Antarctic sea ice extent is growing in a warming ocean?

    It’s easy to see you’re back on your heels here. Please state your Denialism clearly!

    Even your spiritual leader, Mr. Teach, just posted that the Earth is warming.

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