Democrats Looking For Legislative Fight Over Abortifacients

One has to wonder if this is a winning strategy going into the 2014 election cycle. Other than their abortion loving base, will this get out the vote for them? And is it the brightest idea to attack private companies in this manner, attempting to remove their 1st Amendment Rights?

(The Hill) Democrats want to lure Republicans into a fight over birth control with legislation to reverse the Supreme Court’s decision that ObamaCare may not require certain businesses to include contraception in their employee health coverage.

At least three bills are being crafted in the House and Senate to amend the Religious Freedom Restoration Act (RFRA), which the high court used as the basis for its ruling that the contraception mandate violated federal law.

Democrats are expected to introduce the measures prior to Congress’s August recess as part of an effort to recalibrate the party’s election-year messaging. Their hope is to turn out female voters by casting the court’s decision in Burwell v. Hobby Lobby as a strike against reproductive rights.

This could easily backfire, if Republican messaging is on point (yeah, not always something we can count on, though there are always the outside groups making TV commercial buys): they can easily point out that this is not about contraception, but abortifacients. They can also point out that the “contraception mandate” was not, in fact, part of the Obamacare law as written, but wholly a concoction of Team Obama to patronize their base and young women, moochers who want Someone Else to pay for their condoms and birth control pills. Though, of course, avoiding mentioning that last part.

“It will drive women to the polls this November to vote for the women candidates who are on the right side of women’s access to basic healthcare.”

“This will be a huge motivator for women in the fall and a liability for Republican candidates up and down the map,” Democratic Senatorial Campaign Committee (DSCC) spokesman Justin Barasky added.

Abortifacients is a big driver of women to the polls? One has to wonder about their priorities and incompetence in using proper contraception to avoid getting pregnant.

Federal health officials could pursue regulations requiring insurers or the government to pay for birth control for women whose employers opt out of the mandate.

But for now, despite pressure from liberal groups, the White House is putting the onus on Congress. The tactic amounts to inviting the GOP to a legislative fight.

“The best way to resolve this situation is for Congress to pass a law,” White House spokesman Josh Earnest said Monday.

So now it’s up to the Central Government to pay for women to obtain abortifacients? Doesn’t that violate the Hyde Amendment?? Oh, right, loopholes. Why can’t they pay for them themselves? Why is it necessary for Someone Else to pay for them?

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30 Comments »

Comment by Jeffery Subscribed to comments via email
2014-07-08 08:36:09

The right has already lost this argument. No one other than the far-right make the distinction between contraception and your so-called “abortifacients” (they aren’t).

By all means, make the case that Hobby Lobby felt so strongly about keeping an employee that had been raped from taking Plan B that they took it to the Supreme Court. Their position is so far outside the mainstream that even the Republicans will want it to go away.

 
Comment by Nighthawk
2014-07-08 08:48:52

The reason that conservatives make a distinction between contraceptives and abortifacients is because there IS a distinction.

Definitions:

ABORTIFACIENT:
: an agent (as a drug) that induces abortion

CONTRACEPTION:
: deliberate prevention of conception or impregnation

See the difference now??

 
Comment by Trish Mac Subscribed to comments via email
2014-07-08 09:32:19

Nighthawk, nicely done.

 
Comment by Jeffery Subscribed to comments via email
2014-07-08 18:47:05

Nighthawk,

I know the difference. My point was that most people won’t make the distinction – and it’s a tough argument to make, in part because it’s likely not true. See below.

Do you have evidence that Plan B (levonorgestrel; LNG), ella (ulipristal acetate; UPA), the Mirena-IUD (levonorgestrel) or the Cu-IUD induce abortions?

When I searched PubMed (US National Library of Medicine)for the mechanism of emergency contraception (EC) agents and devices I found several papers related to these agents.

e.g.,

“The main mechanism of action of both LNG and UPA for EC (emergency contraception) is delaying or inhibiting ovulation. However, UPA appears to have a direct inhibitory effect on follicular rupture which allows it to be effective even when administered shortly before ovulation, a time period when use of LNG is no longer effective.”

and

“Based on this review of the published literature, it can be concluded that existing methods used today for EC act mainly through inhibition of ovulation or prevention of fertilization.”

Gemzell-Danielsson K, Berger C. Emergency contraception — mechanisms of action. Contraception 87:300-8. 2013.

Although the medical definition of pregnancy is the implantation of a fertilized ovum (embryo) in the uterine lining, some religions consider that life begins the instant the sperm combines with the ovum. Interestingly, about 80% of fertilized ova do not implant and are lost during menses, meaning that 80% of embryos are lost naturally.

According to the medical literature Plan B, ella and the Mirena IUD work as EC by interfering with ovulation when administered at the recommended doses, not by interfering with implantation.

The Supreme Court valued religious beliefs more than science. Do you think that’s a good precedent?

 
Comment by Better_Be_Gumballs Subscribed to comments via email
2014-07-08 20:31:14

J doesn’t know the diff between reality and tv. J wants to be on tv someday to be somebody.

Unfortunately, many women these days, these past 2 generations and the ones turning 70, are the ones that are this shallow.

 
Comment by Jeffery Subscribed to comments via email
2014-07-08 23:46:25

gumballs,

Are you so angry all the time because you are frustrated that your worldview is crumbling around you?

Do YOU have any evidence to support the claim that the 4 Hobby Lobby so-called “abortifacients” cause abortions?

 
Comment by Better_Be_Gumballs Subscribed to comments via email
2014-07-09 19:05:27

Comment by Nighthawk
2014-07-08 08:48:52

The reason that conservatives make a distinction between contraceptives and abortifacients is because there IS a distinction.

Definitions:
ABORTIFACIENT:
: an agent (as a drug) that induces abortion

Comment by Jeffery
2014-07-08 18:47:05

Nighthawk,

I know the difference.

obviously not

 
Comment by gitarcarver Subscribed to comments via email
2014-07-09 19:41:56

Do YOU have any evidence to support the claim that the 4 Hobby Lobby so-called “abortifacients” cause abortions?

The fact that the NIH and the WHO classify abortifacients as causing abortions doesn’t persuade you?

The fact that medical dictionaries say abortifacients “cause a pregnancy to end prematurely” doesn’t mean much to you?

Once again we are dealing with Jeffery denying science and facts.

You cannot fix that kind of stupidity based on ignorance, bigotry and hatred in someone like Jeffery.

 
Comment by Jeffery Subscribed to comments via email
2014-07-09 20:11:36

gitar,

OK. Let’s simplify so you won’t get confused.

Does levonorgestrel (Plan B and Mirena) cause abortions?

If you answer in the affirmative would you please present evidence to support your claim.

 
Comment by Jeffery Subscribed to comments via email
2014-07-09 20:16:22

gitar,

Does the EC ‘ella’ (ulipristal acetate) induce abortions?

If your answer is yes, please supply the evidence. I can be convinced by evidence. Maybe I’m wrong.

 
Comment by Jeffery Subscribed to comments via email
2014-07-09 20:18:37

gitar,

Once you prove you can respond as an adult we can continue. But it means you will have to do a little research rather than just spout off.

 
Comment by Jeffery Subscribed to comments via email
2014-07-09 20:28:39

And the original point was that if the far-right thinks they have a political winner talking about ‘abortifacients’, by all means, go for it. Maybe they can get Todd Akin to make some commercials for them.

Few people care.

 
Comment by gitarcarver Subscribed to comments via email
2014-07-09 22:29:18

Jeffery,

Once you prove you can respond as an adult we can continue.

I am always amazed at your hypocrisy.

You talk about “being an adult” and yet your first post in this thread is the outrageous statement “that Hobby Lobby felt so strongly about keeping an employee that had been raped from taking Plan B that they took it to the Supreme Court.”

You know that is a lie, but yet you kept rockin’ it because, well, that is all you have.

You got upset when after you called a woman and mother a dog, it was implied that your wife was the same. In short, you got mad because the mean man on a blog was saying the same thing about you that you were saying about others. You reacted just like I knew you would – as a little child stomping around and crying how unfair it was.

If you want to debate and discuss things like an adult, I suggest that you grow up first. I know that is hard for a hypocrite and a bigot like you to do, but there is always hope.

Oh, btw, I know that from past experience that you will never admit that you are wrong. Your m.o. is to get the facts wrong, get called out, and then say “I don’t remember that.”

I’ve known 5 year olds that are more mature than you.

Grow up yourself.

 
Comment by Jeffery Subscribed to comments via email
2014-07-09 22:45:53

gitar,

Nice deflection.

Does that mean you have no evidence that your so-called abortion inducing agents (Plan B (levonorgestrel; LNG), ella (ulipristal acetate; UPA), the Mirena-IUD (levonorgestrel)) cause abortions? I couldn’t find any evidence to support the Hobby Lobby position either.

I was surprised to discover how wrong the Hobby Lobbyists and the Catholic wing of the Supreme Court were.

We can drop it then, if you have no evidence.

 
Comment by Better_Be_Gumballs Subscribed to comments via email
2014-07-09 23:16:35

I guess the point of view of abrotifacients, all depends on when you think life starts.

If life starts at the moment of fertilization, then it can be said that these are in fact abortive drugs. If you believe that life doesn’t start until the baby is outside of the womb, then no, only a 3rd trimester spinal chord severing would qualify. But then, to me, that is outright butchery and murder.

Arguing with someone who believe women should not defend themselves against rape, is anti-poor, anti-freedom of choice, …. and in the basic sense … counters his own arguments in the same threat almost every time.. is rather pointless.

 
Comment by gitarcarver Subscribed to comments via email
2014-07-09 23:20:55

Jeffery,

Nice deflection.

What deflection?

You made an accusation and I responded. As usual, you don’t like what is said.

Does that mean you have no evidence that your so-called abortion inducing agents (Plan B (levonorgestrel; LNG), ella (ulipristal acetate; UPA), the Mirena-IUD (levonorgestrel)) cause abortions? I couldn’t find any evidence to support the Hobby Lobby position either.

You didn’t look hard enough. But that’s okay. I expect that from you. I expect you to ignore the facts.

I was surprised to discover how wrong the Hobby Lobbyists and the Catholic wing of the Supreme Court were.

I know you think they were wrong, Jeffery. You hate the idea that the government should not be able to force people to act against their own religious or moral beliefs. As we continue to point out and you continue to demonstrate, you hate the idea of freedom.

We can drop it then, if you have no evidence.

Says the child who has no evidence that the Supreme Court got anything wrong on this case. It is amazing the level of your lack of reading and comprehension skills.

(Well, there is that “evidence” where you say Hobby Lobby wanted to stop an employee from taking an abortificant. That was a lie, and that’s the best that you got, so once again, it sucks to be you.)

 
Comment by Jeffery Subscribed to comments via email
2014-07-09 23:21:11

In the US:

4.3 million live births
0.8 million therapeutic abortions
1 million spontaneous abortions (miscarriages)
6-24 million failure of fertilized ova to implant

Most fertilized ova (embryos) fail to implant.

Worldwide that means that about 150 million – 500 million fertilized ova fail to implant and are expelled and die.

 
Comment by Better_Be_Gumballs Subscribed to comments via email
2014-07-09 23:24:48

you are one sick bastard, J

 
Comment by Jeffery Subscribed to comments via email
2014-07-09 23:40:29

gitar,

The only evidence presented demonstrated that 3 of the 4 HobLobby Four don’t induce abortions.

Absolutely. If a female HobLobby employee gets raped, HobLobby would refuse to pay for Plan B or ella to prevent her pregnancy, even though there is no evidence (unless you’re still searching) that either agent induces an abortion.

Listen, I was as surprised as anyone to find that HobLobby Corporation’s religious principles are based on a falsehood. I assumed that the agents prevented uterine implantation of a fertilized ova, but they do not. They appear to interfere with ovulation and with fertilization.

 
Comment by Jeffery Subscribed to comments via email
2014-07-09 23:49:14

gumballs,

Sick? Why do you say that? These are just facts. Do facts bother you?

Half a billion embryos die naturally every year because they don’t implant in the uterus.

HobLobby went to the Supreme Court to try to save a few potential embryos, yet some 500,000,000 embryos die naturally every year. If I believed in a supreme being I would probably ask why it allowed so many innocent embryos to die.

 
Comment by Better_Be_Gumballs Subscribed to comments via email
2014-07-09 23:49:44

You are digging yourself in deeper there J.

I for one, am now officially offended. You’ve bypassed your troll status to be an official sick lying bastard.

if your job is as you say it is, then you know that all your saying is a lie. Everyone knows that rape victims are NEVER denied plan b pills by hospitals due to what kind of insurance they have, or if they even have insurance or not.

All this shows is your callousness towards women once again. And really, shows your hatred towards women’s independence. You don’t believe women can or should provide for their own health care needs without the govt telling them, or their employer, how to provide that care. You believe that women are incapable of seeing to their own medical needs. many sadly are but that should not be reinforced.

If women fought for the right to dictate what happens to their own bodies, their bodies are their decisions, then why are you, and the commies fighting to have that dictated to them by a gov’t or employer?

You sicken me. I’m done with you.

 
Comment by Jeffery Subscribed to comments via email
2014-07-09 23:53:51

gumballs,

“If life starts at the moment of fertilization, then it can be said that these are in fact abortive drugs.”

No. That was my point. I had assumed the drugs prevented the implantation of a fertilized ova, but they appear to prevent or delay ovulation and interfere with fertilization. The scientific evidence says they do not induce abortions.

 
Comment by Jeffery Subscribed to comments via email
2014-07-09 23:57:36

gumballs,

“You sicken me. I’m done with you.”

Thank gawd.

 
Comment by Jeffery Subscribed to comments via email
2014-07-10 00:02:38

g1 and g2,

Does levonorgestrel induce abortions?

Does ulipristal induce abortions?

If your answer is yes, please present the evidence that supports your claim. If you find reliable evidence that at the approved doses the agents induce abortions I’ll admit I was wrong. Otherwise…

 
Comment by Jeffery Subscribed to comments via email
2014-07-10 00:13:16

gumballs,

Medical science considers that a pregnancy starts with the successful implantation. Most embryos do not implant, and are expelled and die.

Do you consider the hundreds of millions of embryos that die every year to be human deaths? If so, why aren’t you working hard to save them?

 
Comment by gitarcarver Subscribed to comments via email
2014-07-10 00:46:38

Jeffery,

Is it your contention that the government has classified the drugs incorrectly?

Are you aware that the government did not challenge the idea that the drugs are not abortificants in any court filing or argument?

Are you aware that the Supreme Court decision did not rely on whether the drugs are abortificants or not?

The SCOTUS and Hobby Lobby didn’t get the facts of the case (and therefore the decision) wrong,……

YOU DID.

Geez it sucks to be you.

 
Comment by Jeffery Subscribed to comments via email
2014-07-10 07:16:01

gitar,

Yes.

Geez it sucks to be you.

 
Comment by Jeffery Subscribed to comments via email
2014-07-10 10:54:22

gitar,

And my congratulations on you finally making an argument, and a compelling one. You’ve appealed to the authority of the Executive Branch of the Federal Gov’t of these United States. In the face of withering scientific evidence and data demonstrating the opposite, you side with a lumbering branch of the Federal Gov’t.

Don’t get me wrong, I respect the FDA and the officials and scientists there. They have to make decisions affecting the health and lives of most Americans. They are understaffed, but have always been courteous, professional, businesslike, and in my experience, correct in their decisions. But ponderous. Yet, when an organization submits a Investigation New Drug (IND) application (to begin a clinical trial) by statute the FDA must respond within 30 days (and they do). Our last IND was some 8000 pages of data and proposals!! They work their butts off.

I am correct that medical science doesn’t consider the agents to induce abortions. When I search the FDA database

http://www.accessdata.fda.gov/drugsatfda_docs/label/2009/021998lbl.pdf

I find: “Plan B One-Step is not effective in terminating an existing pregnancy. (5.2)”

and:

“12 CLINICAL PHARMACOLOGY
12.1 Mechanism of Action
Emergency contraceptive pills are not effective if a woman is already pregnant. Plan B One-Step is believed to act as an emergency contraceptive principally by preventing ovulation or fertilization (by altering tubal transport of sperm and/or ova). In addition, it may inhibit implantation (by altering the endometrium). It is not effective once the process of implantation has begun.”

Medical science now says no, but the Federal Gov’t still says “it may inhibit implantation” in the Plan B One-Step label, last revised over 5 years ago.

You win.

 
Comment by Better_Be_Gumballs Subscribed to comments via email
2014-07-10 11:09:57

Gitarcarver,
It is blatantly obvious that many don’t understand the differences and distinctions between ovulation, fertilization and implantation.

 
Comment by Jeffery Subscribed to comments via email
2014-07-10 12:55:54

gumballs,

“It is blatantly obvious that many don’t understand the differences and distinctions between ovulation, fertilization and implantation.”

I agree with you on that but not for the reason you think.

 
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